Internet Update (Kris)

It's been about a week since I decided to try the internet. I signed up for two pretty popular sites. I wasn't so impressed. It seemed I was getting the most attention from guys at least 15 years older than me, sometimes much more. It was creepy. I've dated a wide range of ages, and don't think age is always important, but to have 55+ men be the primary contact was turning me off the internet dating scene. Luckily, Bridget filled me in on how to only show my profile to the age range I choose. But still, I wasn't feeling too excited about anyone I was finding or the process. I'm not giving up on those sites, I signed up for 3 months and will give it a good effort. I did decide that maybe I needed to try a different type of site. I signed up for LDS Promise, thinking it may have people who are a little more serious about relationships and less into playing. I signed up yesterday, so far, I've liked it. I like the matching process instead of mass profile surfing, and felt like I've been matched with some decent guys. Well see how it goes.

dangerously stupid (by marcia)

I had a Bishop once who explained in his annual morality talk that there are actions that are either definitely black or definitely white. Then there is this big grey area in the middle. He called this the dangerously stupid zone. Over the years I’ve extended this analogy to other areas of life and I realize that I’ve spent a fair amount of time wandering aimlessly in the dangerously stupid zone.

It’s been a few days since Clue and I had our last relationship talk when he asked whether I was emotionally available. I am out of town this week so I’ve had time to process his question. We’ve talked on the phone a few times and have had some great conversations about life, politics and the world we live in. We haven’t talked about my emotional availability, but I know it’s on both of our minds.

Maybe I’m being defensive, but I honestly don’t feel that I am generally emotionally unavailable – I just ended a fairly serious relationship a week before I met Clue, so I think it would be more of a concern if I was ready to jump back into another relationship so soon. I also haven’t been able to determine whether this relationship with Clue hasn’t progressed because I’m not ready or because the “it” factor just isn’t there. There were a few times early on when I considered canceling a date with Clue because I just wasn’t feeling the love, but for some reason (most likely that Cowardice and Avoidance thing), I always kept our dates. So after three months, I feel like we’re progressing…albeit slowly. I will say that I have really missed Clue this week and am anxious to get home on Saturday to see him. And when I do, I am going to be open to Clue and our relationship. I am going to tear down, ignore or crash through those walls. I am going to be open, available and loving. It things don’t click, they don’t click. But I am going to be so ready in case they do.

I do have one complication though…BH is coming to town. I finally told Clue that he was coming and he just asked, “is he coming to see you?” I loved hearing the relief in his voice when I replied no. I did warn him that BH tends to show up at my house a lot when he’s in town. Our lives were pretty intertwined – his car is still at my house and he has stuff in my garage and we need to take care of those kinds of things. I’m also planning on talking to BH when he gets here – we left some things unsaid and I feel the need to just do a bit of tidying up. I was honest and said that I still care about BH and probably always will, but I was totally over him.

I promised Clue there was nothing to worry about, but I could almost hear my Bishop whispering, “you’re entering the dangerously stupid zone…”

Well Intended Insults (Kris)

I work in small office. I really like the two partners of the firm, but sometimes they like to take on a "fatherly" role. I had my annual "why aren't you married" talk from my boss today. I'm not an easily offended person. I realize this is coming from a place of concern and kindness. He told me he and his partner discussed me over lunch- no, not my job performance, my personal life. I know he was trying to be complimentary. I think what he was trying to say was, "We think you're great and we don't understand why some guy hasn't seen that." What he actually said was, "We can't figure out why you're single, we think you're just being too picky." UGH.

I have a good relationship with my boss and flat out told him that was offensive. I acknowledged that he was trying to be kind, but told him that suggesting I'm too picky when he has no clue about my personal life was out of line. (ok, I wasn't quite that direct) I've decided, if anything, I'm not picky enough- that's another blog.

I think it's interesting how married people (particularly my parent's generation) have no idea how to deal with us "older" single people. It's like this elephant in the room and nobody knows how to talk about it. I recently saw the movie Baby Mama and the main character's mother called her being single an "alternative lifestyle". I liked that. I think the awkwardness comes from people approaching us singles like my boss did- trying to tell me what is wrong with me. So, of course, I react to that and then neither of us want to talk about it again. I don't know why it can't be discussed just as genuine interest in who I am, without the judgment.

I don't think I should be pitied or tiptoed around because I'm almost 40 and single. I have a really interesting life and some pretty hilarious dating stories. I love when people are interested and ask questions, not try to be my therapist.

There's my little rant.

Camping with Consequences (Marnie)

This weekend I went camping with some friends. It's the first time I've been camping since I went backpacking with Rebound. I had never been backpacking before and Rebound basically taught me all the ropes: he checked over my gear, spent hours talking to me about how to use the wilderness as my toilet and other tricks of the trade. In the end the backpacking trip was a great experience! But it was a week later that we had "the talk"...

He's the first guy I've tried to be friends with after trying the dating thing. He took to the change very well! Probably because he had made that decision a month earlier in his subconscious mind while he started pulling away (but left me in the dark). But I'm ok with that now.

Being friends has been mostly good and very revealing as to why it's a good idea we don't focus on just each other. The more we talk, the more I agree we aren't for each other. That left me feeling really good about moving on. Don't get me wrong, I was very disappointed and very sad to lose the potential of a relationship with him (who doesn't when you are single and 37??), but in the end, it's been a good decision.

However, this trip down to the same general area, with my new sleeping bag that he helped me pick out, and all the new camping skills he had taught me left me constantly thinking and talking about him all weekend long. And that bugged me! When I talked about him, I sounded like I still had a crush on him like when we first started dating! Do I? If I weren't me, I would have thought so! And that brought me down much more than I thought - and it was almost like I was going through the loss of him again. I had to get past that relationship AGAIN. It was so annoying! I say annoying because I really thought I was well on my way to moving on to bigger and better things! And proving to myself and the world I was ready for the "right" someone to come along.

I'm sure the weekend was therapeutic for me because apparently I had some left-over processing that needed to be done to really move into the "friend" relationship. I guess I can't just tell myself when I'm done mourning over a lost relationship or make myself feel complete again after losing something that really made me happy for a time. That sucks.

It requires time. Time and conscious effort. And unfortunately, I guess I needed both.

NOW I hope I'm done!

Talking (Leah)

I just wanted to share a little lesson I learned recently. The last fellow I dated complained that I "talked" too much - as in I told too many people too much about me/him/us. I think it made him feel overexposed and insecure. I selfishly thought he was silly. I was talking to my friends about what mattered to me - it had nothing to do with him really.

Since then, though, I've done some thinking. In an effort to honor his wishes I've tried to not discuss him anymore with friends or family. ALSO (now this may come as a surprise to some) I've restrained myself from discussing some very personal thoughts with some people. I've wanted to practice this behavior and even though the guy isn't a part of my life now I want to honor what I learned from the relationship at least. On this blog I tell some stuff that I wonder if I really should tell, but that's one reason I try to maintain the anonymity. Since I've started doing this I have to say I feel great!

In fact, I was thinking the other day about how when someone is going through a really hard time everyone has to ask "how are you doing" and that person gets sick of the question. It's not like life gets better or easier and so that question becomes increasingly depressing. I don't think said person will ever be able to get out of that sad state with continued discussion focusing on it. In terms of my dating life, every time someone asks "how is Phil" I get talking and thinking and obsessing and next thing I know there is little left of meaning in my life other than the Phil drama. And the more I talk about Phil the more people need to ask about him.

As older single women we hate being asked "why aren't you married yet" but then it seems that's the only topic we discuss. The bigger deal you make of something the bigger deal it becomes. I don't want all my friend relationships to be based on the latest progress of my Phil relationship. So I've decided that I want to have my life less Phil oriented and just more me oriented. That won't affect my blogging here - so no worries - but I have to say I'm a believer in sharing less. After all, the only people who know what is best in a relationship are the two people in it. I think I'll do better in my next relationship if I don't try to include 10 of my closest friends who have all the best and kindest intentions.

Sorry - I think that was a bit rambly, but I hope you catch my drift!

Guacamole,the deciding factor (Bridget)

So, I had a first conversation a couple of nights ago with my newest internet possibility, I'll call him Dodger guy. My roommates, Liz and Dre and I have been known to give new guys nicknames until they have earned the status of actually being called by their God given name. There has been What's his face, an editor of films in L.A, Baseball Guy,a triple A baseball player, and Vegas guy, a cop..who didn't make it anywhere near being called his actual name. With the line up of men that I have come across,there seems to be no rhyme or reason to why I actually do give a guy a chance or really any good reason to cast them aside. I have been known to drop a guy for really minor reasons, such as one guy didn't know what Stratford Upon Avon was. That just seemed really unforgiveable at the time. Another guy gave me a scare when he said he had never heard of the Indigo Girls. Now, I'm a fan, but not a huge fan, and ultimately I think it really came to the notion that a person that is aware of their surroundings, and that grew up in the 80's would have AT LEAST heard of the Indigo Girls. Weird reasoning on my part? Yes absolutely. And I'm aware that it is. On the other hand, I have given my heart to others in spite of insurmountable issues, such as,well, one of us being gay and in another instance one of us living in New York City, to name only a couple. With talk in Marcia's blog about unavailable hearts,it has moved me to consider whether in fact,what I have on the surface considered as my ever availability,is actually monumental unavailability in disguise. I think I need help with this...because in a second anything can change..this new Dodger Guy could be unknowingly stepping into a mine field when he confesses that he say,doesn't like guacamole, and then I would be forced to reconsider my friendship with him, "what, who doesn't like guacamole, definitely not the man i'm meant to be with"....weird..i think i need help...and like Marcia says, the first thing is acknowledging it...where's that number for my therapist...this is not a good sign...

the first step (by Marcia)

Tonight Clue told me (in a very kind way) that he didn’t think I was emotionally available for a relationship. I was dumbfounded. Speechless. Not because that’s what he thought of me, but because I was actually on the other end of that phrase. I’m supposed to be the emotionally available one. In fact, that’s my somewhat comforting explanation as to why my past relationships haven’t worked out – it was the guy who wasn’t available. Not me.

After I regained my power of speech, defensiveness instantly kicked in and I was mentally preparing my rebuttal, but then I realized something. He was right! In seconds I decided that I needed to change and become available. Just how I will do that isn’t all that clear at the moment, but I trust that something will come to me. They say that acknowledgment is the first step. What’s the second?

7 Habits of highly effective online daters(Bridget)

This is for you Kris, from one online dater to another, passing the proverbial torch..make me proud little one.

1.Please do not look at a guy's profile multiple times. LDS planet SAYS that one can look at another's profile as many times as they want in one day and it will count as one. If you trust this you will be sorry. Recently, and this has happened more than once (one time shame on them, two times shame on me, three times...I deserve to be alone on a Saturday night) I will be sharing emails filled with witty repartee with a gentleman, and believing that it will only count as one look, I will sneak another peak at their profile,or maybe say twelve peaks,and by gosh, I will never hear from them again...

2. Do not get online after 10pm unless you're looking for a booty chat..they rarely respect you in the morning

3. Go with your gut...you have that certain something inside that tells you if you should keep chatting/email with this guy...if there's red flags already...and you haven't even i/m'd him,keep moving

4. Don't ask a guy that says he valet parks for a living, what his "plan" is,as if he absolutely must have one..that just makes for awkward chatting

5. Flirt Responsibly...it can go places you don't want it to go...fast

6. Be an equal opportunity dater...pictures and profiles can be deceiving in a good way and bad way. Try and be open to all possibilities.

7. Make sure to invest time and energy on some flattering pictures. No one wants to see the picture you've taken of yourself in the bathroom mirror with your Motorola..this will go a long way, and really speaks of the level of pride you have in yourself, i think.

So there...the seven habits of highly effective online daters. Take it for what its worth...and good luck with your online escapades...

Disconnected Ramble and My Evening with X (Kris)

I was shopping with a college roommate last week and bought some fun green summer wedges. I told her that now I just needed a date so I could wear them. She reminded me that when we were in college and I was feeling the need to go out, I would just call a guy and ask him to take me out that night. Surprisingly, it worked. I've been craving a night out on the town that doesn't involve a huge group of people, but I can't imagine myself doing that now. Maybe I've gotten scared, or maybe that behavior is only appropriate in your 20's and a little juvenile now.

I don't want to come off as desperate, like I'm begging for a date. I don't feel like it's desperation, just normal to want to have some quality time with the opposite sex. I had a good friend in college who dated a lot. Even if there wasn't a girl he was really interested in pursing romantically, he would go on "friend" dates. He once explained to me that he felt men and women complimented each other, and it was important for balance in his life to spend quality time with women on a regular basis. He was not a player, but very sincere and took genuine interest in everyone he dated. I think that is profound. We talk/hear so much about the differences between men and women and how it separates us, but I think a good context for the discussion is how our differences can make relationships interesting, complimentary and necessary.

There is one guy I can always count on for a fun evening out. My ex (X). We have been friends a long time, before we dated and afterwards. We've stayed in touch and go out occasionally. He's a good dater- meaning, even though we're going out as friends, he still makes me feel like a girl. He's always a gentleman, willing to drive, pay (I usually offer dutch though), and knows all those little things that make you feel feminine. We talked recently and decided to go out last night. Ex's are nice in that you know each other really well (X knows all my secrets and vice versa) and can talk really candidly. I have no question where I stand with X. We can openly appreciate each other and know exactly the boundaries of the relationship. Although, he got a little flustered when I teased him that I had joked with my sisters when I bought the new shirt I was wearing that I'd feel so sassy wearing it that I'd probably put out with whoever was willing to take me out. :) Anyway, thank heaven for good men who, with no strings attached, just enjoy treating women like women. X has always been good with that. It is so appreciated.

the click...or it's me not you (by marcia)

A good way to humiliate yourself is to write down some of your deepest thoughts, fears and emotions and then send it to the guy you are dating. When I told Chris (my Voice of Reason) that I was going to be a contributing writer on this blog, he recommended that I take up a less dangerous hobby…such as hang gliding.

In case anyone is curious, Clue and BH and anyone else I write about, knows about this blog. I actually send them what I write before I post it so they have a chance to dispute, correct or enhance anything. I sent the “therapy” bit to Clue before we went out on Friday and then spent a couple of days wishing I had gone hang gliding.

After I emailed “therapy” to Clue, he just replied “I’m glad you shared it with me. It will give us an opening to talk about some of those things.” Ugh. Relationship talks are not one of my strong points. In fact, one time I think I dated a guy a year before we had our first relationship talk.

So on Friday Clue picks me up and we can both sense this huge elephant in the room right away. We get in his car to go to dinner and that elephant is right there with us. I finally break the ice and blurt out, “I feel totally exposed.” He laughed and I realized he was actually enjoying this. I let him enjoy it – he deserved it after everything I’d put him through. We drove to the restaurant and talked. We sat on the patio at a Thai restaurant and talked. We came back to my place and talked. I have to say, it was one of the most honest, open, refreshing relationship talks I’ve ever had. To re-phrase, I was completely honest, completely open – more so than I’ve ever been.

First of all, it cleared up a few things. We’d had some miscommunication about schedules and availability. I thought I had told him that the only days I wasn’t available last week were Wednesday and Saturday. He had sent an email saying that he was buried with work and later in the week would work better for him – but of course he doesn’t remember that part. I believe he was used to and expected me to “give him a sliver of my time” as he put it and interpreted me and my schedule accordingly, which, based on the past few months, I can’t blame him. So when I told him that I had to take my brother to the airport and wasn’t available until 8pm on Friday, he decided to blow me off and go to Moab. So that whole thing about patience? Not true.

We also talked about where we are in this relationship and what we hoped to get out of it. I found Clue to be very sensitive and understanding. We talked about BH a bit and he totally understood not being ready to be in another serious relationship. He also asked if I’ve the chance to grieve after we broke up which I thought was interesting. One night about a month ago BH and I talked for about two hours late into the night. I hung up and cried for awhile. Not because of anything we had talked about, but because I felt totally empty after we hung up. We have this great friendship and have a great conversation and then hang up and there’s a big-fat-empty-nothing hanging over me. I couldn’t sleep so I wrote a therapeutic page or two about him. So yes, I’ve grieved. Actually, now I feel totally over BH. In past post-break-up cycles, we would stay friends but in the back of my mind was the idea that maybe he would want to marry me. I don’t have that in the back of my mind anymore.

Clue is looking for someone he enjoys spending time with and then actually spending time together – something I’ve been avoiding. I’ve enjoyed the time we have spent together, but I’ve kept fairly aloof, utilizing my work travel schedule to space things out. The travel stuff is legit, but when I’m in town, I’ve been reluctant to spend a lot of time together and I’m not sure why.

I told Clue that I like him, that there’s a lot of things I admire about him and that I’ve enjoyed getting to know him better, but I haven’t experienced that “click.” It could be the timing. It could be me. It could be him. I actually told him all that. Honest and candid conversations may be old hat to some people, but I am a graduate of the School of Cowardice and Avoidance. These baby steps are giant to me.

He asked if I wanted to keep seeing each other and I replied yes (the conversation was a bit more in depth, but this is the gist of it). At the end of the evening we just sat in silence, his arms wrapped around me and he would kiss me on my forehead once in awhile. It was nice.

So he’s making me dinner for me after church tonight. I’m sure it will be a lovely evening – just before I fly out tomorrow for another business trip.